Liam McCormick

We ask each of our guests a simple yet profound question: "Whose life story from your own family would you most want to have documented on film?"

Today's guest: Liam McCormick, 

Liam's pick: His father James McCormick

Sound Bites

"Knowing something of my past helps me make sense of who I am."

"How did my grandfather make the life choices he made?"

"The wisdom of being content, but keep pushing."

Summary

Liam McCormick discusses his desire to document the life story of his grandfather, James McCormick. Liam reflects on the importance of knowing one's family history and how it can help make sense of oneself. He shares his curiosity about his grandfather's experiences as an immigrant and his motivations for the life choices he made. Liam also expresses his desire to learn from his grandfather's wisdom and seek advice on navigating  the transitions and challenges of life. He envisions this podcast as a way to pass on family values and inspire his own children.

About Liam
Liam is British, but fell in love with an American woman. He and his wife have three sons together. Liam spent the first 16 years of his life working in the British army, and he later started a career in the nonprofit sector. Today, he is the executive director and senior strategist of UBS Bank's Family Advisor and Philanthropy Services. He sits on the America's team. When Liam was a kid, his family moved a lot and they moved to the Middle East. It was a hugely impressive and transformational time and experience for him with new sites, new smells, new foods and lifestyle.

Takeaways

• Knowing one's family history can help make sense of oneself and provide a sense of identity.
• Documenting the life story of a family member can pass on family values and inspire future generations.
• Seeking wisdom and advice from older generations can help navigate the challenges and transitions of life.
• Understanding the experiences of immigrants can provide insights into resilience and adaptation.
• Sharing personal stories and experiences can convey values and inspire others.

Join Us
Visit us at storykeep.com/podcast to learn more about how StoryKeep is preserving family histories. Subscribe on your favorite platform to catch new episodes released bi-weekly, available in both audio and video formats.

Join me, Jamie Yuenger, as we go on a journey of remembrance and discovery, celebrating the stories of those we cherish. Don’t miss our enriching journey—subscribe today and be part of "Who We Remember."

Credits
Produced by Jamie Yuenger and Piet Hurkmans. Our show’s musical intro and outro is taken from the track “Thursday” by the independent artist Nick Takénobu Ogawa. You can listen and support his music on bandcamp here

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:13

Hello, my name is Jamie Younger. Welcome to the Story Keep podcast who we Remember. On this show I speak with a wide variety of guests about one family member's life story that they would love to have documented on film, whether the person is living or deceased. We explore their spirit and share some of their incredible life stories and surprising histories. Most of us think too late about capturing the stories of our loved ones. These conversations elevate and honor and speak to one person's lasting influence. I promise that you will walk away feeling moved and challenged and hopefully inspired anew to think about your own life and the impact that you want to make.

Speaker 1: 0:57

Today I am joined by Liam McCormick. His life and his story intertwines with the extraordinary life of his grandfather, james McCormick. Liam's grandfather, james, grew up in Ireland during the partition and the creation of Northern Ireland. Before we fully step into James' story, let me introduce you to his grandson, my guest, liam. Liam McCormick is British but fell in love with an American woman. He and his wife have three sons together. Liam spent the first 16 years of his life working in the British Army and he later started a career in the nonprofit sector. Today, he is the executive director and senior strategist of UBS Bank's Family Advisor and Philanthropy Services. He sits on the Americas team.

Speaker 1: 1:41

When Liam was a kid, his family moved a lot and they moved to the Middle East. It was a hugely impressive and transformational time and experience for him, with new sites, new smells, new foods and lifestyle. I'm really looking forward to introducing you to Liam. Let's dive in. So we're going to launch right in. We're just going to get into the juicy center and well, I mean, first of all, thanks for taking time to sit to talk about your grandfather. So, liam, why, when I asked you whose life story from your own family you would want to have documented on film, why did your mind go to your grandfather, james?

Speaker 2: 2:35

It's something I've been thinking of for a while. You often hear people who would you have for dinner or what you do there, and I've also thought about all the great people in history, the wonderful people. But in the last decade or so I never met my grandfather and I have his DNA, his blood runs through my veins and I know my father and he is obviously a representative of him. But I would love to hear some stories, but not a lot of stories. My dad never really talked about him and then, more recently, as I've had my own children, you just get more interested in who you are. Where have I come from?

Speaker 2: 3:27

I think knowing where you've come from can help you discern where you're going, especially when you get to those points in life where you're so busy being a parent, working and all the stuff that we do, it can sometimes feel like you're not going anywhere, and so for me, you know, knowing something of my past and it kind of, I think it might help me make sense of myself as well. In in thinking about him and the limited information I have, even just preparing for this podcast, I learned new things. I knew stories are out there, but just being able to tie them down a little bit and and speak to my dad and find a little bit more having the opportunity to do that. So, if nothing more, it's already helped me make a little bit more sense of who I am, knowing a bit more about him what?

Speaker 1: 4:20

what did you? What do you know about your grandfather, james mccormick?

Speaker 2: 4:24

well, um, I know he was one of 10 brothers and sisters, which kind of blew my mind a little bit. I knew they were a big family, but even that number itself, you think, my goodness me, what would it be? My great-grandmother? I know it's quite common, probably back in those days, but even that, you know, I know it's quite common, probably back in those days. But but even that, and and as I thought about it, um, you know here the context which he grew up, and he grew up in ireland before his partition, but, and in northern ireland what it is today, but to him it would have been ireland. He went through that, went through partition, um, and so, yeah, that in itself just the span of his life and how much the world changed the fact that he was an immigrant. He moved from Ireland.

Speaker 2: 5:10

I'm an immigrant myself. I moved to America. He moved to America as a young man and then moved back to marry my grandmother and she didn't really want to go. It was too far for her to go to America. So they moved to the UK and to England, so Coventry. So that sense of being an immigrant, the call to adventure overseas my life, without thinking, and that's what my father did as well. So we were children, we moved a lot. We moved around lots of different countries, and so there's an awareness that maybe you know that's what my grandfather did. He moved countries, and so it's not, it's not an alien concept, it's not like you've lived in one village your whole life.

Speaker 1: 5:55

Your entire life, yeah and so, looking at that, I mean, if you were to just really use your imagination, like, okay, this is your grandfather I don't know when in our imaginations, at what point you know how old he would be that we would say, okay, we want to sit you down, we want to film you and record your life story. If we were going to do like a little intake together, right, and I was going to say, okay, liam, what, what would you want me to ask your grandfather about? What is like top on your list, what, what would you, um, most want to kind of learn about or dig into what? What would that be?

Speaker 2: 6:33

beyond specific stories, yeah, I think there's a. I think it's because I've limited amount of information. Um, I'd love to dig into the bits that I know and maybe it's a little bit event driven. I'd love to ask him some. So I know he was a good tenor, for example. He sang and you know he was had renowned within his community for singing, so they'd get him to sing songs.

Speaker 2: 7:02

And I was talking to my dad about this. He, dad said, oh, one of my father's earliest memories was was him singing galway bay? And I thought what on earth is that? And I looked it up and you know some, you can find this, and and or he'd sing, uh, the holy city, which you know, the church people, and again, I'd never really heard that song. It was weird listening to it because in my mind it was like I wonder why he chose this song and so and and.

Speaker 2: 7:26

Then the other thing I'd love to to dig into, because I know that as a young boy he watched the titanic being looked. Living in belfast, you know that would have been at a major event, major, a major event and not everybody would involve it, because about the whole of belfast back in the day was the whole economy was built around shipbuilding and the docks there. And the other interesting thing I discovered later was that my wife, who's American, her grandfather came from Belfast as well and we know that as young boys they were both at the launch of the titanic and you know. So it's kind of is a strange connection that my grandfather went to england, her grandfather went to new york, and you know her father's american that is wild that they were both there yeah, and so I just think that would be interesting in terms of what you know what.

Speaker 2: 8:23

And then my grandfather, um, you know, trained to be a naval architect. So I just think that would be interesting in terms of what you know, what is it? And then my grandfather, um, you know, trained to be a naval architect. So I just wonder, maybe that was the only option he had. But well, no, they were. They were landowners, they had flax mills and bits and pieces. So I just wondered, if that was, I'd love to know that. What was you know what? What were the you know what, what? What the motivations for you to make the life choices that you made? Was it? So think? I think some of the things I just because I, you know, try it. As we're faced with with choices, there's always often things you can do.

Speaker 1: 8:57

Knowing how he made those decisions, what were the influences on him, would be would to me yeah, and you were saying earlier you know being in the midst of the thick of life, of you know being in your career and your kids, and what is this all about and the decisions to make. Let's say you were able to talk to him and document him in his later years. Let's hope that he has this, you know, wisdom built up, would there?

Speaker 1: 9:26

be yes yes any point of uh you know question of wisdom or advice that you would posit to him yeah, um, what kind of wisdom.

Speaker 2: 9:39

um, I guess the one of the interesting things I've noticed in life is when you, when you, when you're young and you're 20s and 30s, I had a vision for where my life might be, you know, being a parent, you know working and and and probably being a parent of teenagers, you sort of that's the vision that was there, I'm there and it's kind of that's the vision that was there and I'm there and it's kind of, oh, I don't have any vision for old age. I don't have any. I'm 50, so probably there as well. But you know what is? What does that look? How do you that? The next transition? I'm kind of gosh, what, what does that look like? And how do you? You know motivation and then your values as well.

Speaker 2: 10:25

I know he was a man of values. Obviously he was a man of faith. So and I just love to, you know, have some of those conversations about platinum, what? How do we prepare for the next week? How do we continue to keep going? My eldest is about to go to college and I've got three boys. I'm still in this phase for a while, but how do we make sure we're ready for the next week? Being empty nesters and maintaining relationships which are difficult overseas, finding that identity, particularly if you've sowed the seeds of restlessness, as we say, which seems to be our generational inheritance of keep moving. And so it's probably a bit vague, but I think some of those, the wisdom of being content but keep pushing.

Speaker 1: 11:24

The wisdom of being content.

Speaker 1: 11:26

I was just talking to my husband, pete, last night and I said to him it feels like the magic trick of life that we're supposed to somehow figure out supposed to somehow figure out, and it's very hard to figure out how to really do.

Speaker 1: 11:41

The magic trick, well, is that we simultaneously are pushing forward and forth and striving and driving right towards meaning and waking up in the morning and doing something that means something to us and hopefully adds value to the world. And it's a process of refinement with the balance that in every single moment it's imperfectly perfect and we cannot make it more perfect than it is. It's already perfect, being completely imperfect, but yet we can't just sit around on the couch and do nothing because it's imperfectly perfect. We also still get, still get up right. So it's like somehow, that magic trick of yeah, some it seems that we would hope that your grandfather will would have figured out by the time we interviewed him to tell us how to do that magic trick yes, no, that's a good way of putting it and and and the idea that you're constantly evolving.

Speaker 2: 12:39

I feel like you get to a point in life and I was listening to this the other day you get to a point in life where you're competent in your career, you have all this knowledge and you have this wisdom that you trade for income, and I think being a parent is a great example of how you get competent at that teenage level. But suddenly they're becoming adults and I'm not competent at that. So it's like oh, and then imposter syndrome comes back in and goes I thought I had this all sorted out, and then you know, and then, same as your career, gets a point where I can do this, not with my eyes closed, but I can do this without the and and part of you, I feel a part of me, needs the challenge, or you know the stretch. Maybe the challenge is the wrong word. We don't want they, we don't want a lot of challenge, but some challenge is good because it's actually I, I think part of the happiness or joy, or what do you want?

Speaker 2: 13:35

to it is engaging in keeping yourself challenged to a point where you're learning and growing and reaching your potential, and maybe you never fully to your point. You never fully reach your potential because there's imperfections, we have character flaws which constantly working out. And so, yeah, and I wonder, I just think you know what? What? What you know, he lives through quite a lot of big transitions. How did he manage that?

Speaker 1: 14:09

Yeah, and I, I mean, if I were just, you know, sitting in the opportunity to speak with your grandfather, I would sort of considering the time he grew up in, like looking at what would he say about this time that's so ruled by social media and so ruled by things being fast-paced, but his life was also so much about movement. But would he have something to say to I don't know, helping you figure out how to, like you know, raise your children. I mean, we don't usually like our parents to give us much advice on that, but maybe our grandparents. We take a leaf out of their book.

Speaker 2: 14:50

Well, I well I feel like, and, uh, my parents have ever listened to this rule. But parental advice, when it comes to grandchildren, um, your children, tends to be criticism, a list of things you're getting wrong, um, and I always encourage them to say I will listen to the christ, but I need, I need five positive things which were getting right for one negative, because, but that's our instinct, oh well, you know, they didn't say thank you when I did this. I'm sorry about that, and they've done something well. And so, yeah, I suspect there's. And to your point about, as you're talking, I was just thinking actually my grandfather moved to Partition, so that's when Ireland, you know, separated and became Northern Ireland and Southern Ireland, and my grandmother was from Roscommon, which is south.

Speaker 2: 15:40

She's protestant, so you know they, he was already in northern ireland. So if you think of a time of division, you know fracture, that can't have been any more fractious than sectarian than it was then. And so you know, when you, particularly in america, but around the world, when you see the world we're at where we, it feels not too dissimilar. Maybe it's a reflection of our human nature rather than technology that you know we've always been doing this, you know, pulling into tribes around things. It's just those tribes have become even smaller because social media has enabled us to um, find a smaller and smaller groups of people who think like us or have those views. So, um, uh, yeah, I think you'd have a lot to say about you know how, how to do that, um and with it without compromising yourself too much.

Speaker 1: 16:38

And if you were to think I mean, we asked you the question for yourself whose story you would want to have documented what could you imagine that kind of document offering your three children?

Speaker 2: 16:57

I think one of the things when I speak to a lot of parents and I think about what? What do you really want for your kids? You? You kind of want them to continue the story of your family, whether it's values. You want them to share your values and those, those values might be the same but they might look different. And so my grandfather and I don't know this, but he worked hard. So work ethic might be his value, but was so ingrained in his work and doing what he did that my father never saw him, or because he was involved in it. So you might still have the value of work ethic, but you might have um balance in there as well. I value that, but I want to have more balance in my life and I think I wonder if through the story of his life, they rather just go. These are my values x, y and z. You know type of the work ethic.

Speaker 2: 17:57

You know it's hard to hear that and listen, whereas when you hear a story, this is the story of my life and neither the events I found really pivotal I watched the uh, the titanic being launched or I participated in this. You know he lived through that. He didn't. He was probably too young to be in the first world war, but he would have seen some of the stuff there. Now, what does it take to be an immigrant in a, in a in a different country, where you know, back in the day, where irish was, you know it said no irish gypsies or dogs or something like that. You know. So, you've had someone, some experience of that, and I think you know. So those stories convey values which they may not be explicit. So I think by hearing that story, it will be a way of my children going okay, this is our legacy in some respects, the lessons that I made. And so when they encounter difficulty, when they encounter something, it's not what do I do, or what did my father do, what did my grandfather, what did my great grandfather do? Oh they, they stuck at it. They hadn't, they had, you know, they kept going, they didn't give up or whatever it is Cause they've got, they've got the stat story to, to, to draw the values from it and give them inspiration.

Speaker 2: 19:16

I saw, yeah, a great quote once from I think it was Grant Robinson. I'm like Morrison, actually Grant Morrison, I think his name is. He does cartoons and he said you can't, you know, we're all part of someone's story, we're born into somebody else's story. It's around those lines, somebody else's story it's around those lines, and so you, you it's. It's important to know the story you're part of, because if you know the story you're part of, you can kind of helps you form a question, answer the question of um, what's my role, who am I meant to be, what am I meant to do? And so if you know the bigger story which you're, it doesn't mean you have to do something, but it gives you content.

Speaker 2: 20:04

If you discover your grandfather or your father was a famous Jedi and you didn't know that, it might make sense of yourself and so you could become a Jedi. Or you know that my grandfather one of the pictures I was doing, he was in the garden, he loved his garden. I thought, oh, I like gardening. And now my father also likes gardening. And so you know, although my gardening, I wouldn't describe myself as greedy, but there's part of me that loves being in nature, whether it's although I have three boys and trying to get them to cut the grass, and that's not really gardening. Is it Cutting the hedges?

Speaker 1: 20:43

It's not.

Speaker 2: 20:45

It is, but it's an important part of it maintaining the environment, I mean, although nowadays you're meant to let them go wild, but anyway. So I feel you know, knowing some of that stuff, it helps you connect. It's not just me. I have a heritage of family members who did this. I wish I the heritage of family, family members who did this. I wish I was a better singer. I'm not, I'm certainly not a tenor, but that to me, I'd love singing, and so I thought maybe there is a. There's also part of me that there's something in that, you know. Um, so right now it isn't probably front and center of my boys minds, I think, but other stuff, but as they go to have that legacy to reflect back and go, ah, that makes sense of myself.

Speaker 1: 21:25

Yeah, it helps me make sense of myself. I'm just envisioning that, absolutely, if we had had the chance to make a film about his life, that we would definitely have to have some incredible acapella singing.

Speaker 2: 21:41

Yes, that would have been great. You'd get him. I mean, wouldn't that be an interesting question to him? What's your favorite song, or what was the first, what's the first song you ever learned? Because that unlocks a different part of the story we get, I mean, as I say because I only know the event stuff. It may be know why did you sing galway bay? Is it because you were from galway or is it? Did I mean those questions about, about music?

Speaker 1: 22:07

because, again, the music sort of access is a different part of your story yeah, absolutely, and uh, and maybe he just starts singing, singing spontaneously that would be yes yes, a golden shot yeah yeah, yeah, well, um, just as we're closing out here, I'm curious, um, and you can take the time you need to think about this um, if you, if you I know you didn't meet him. I think you did say that he held you, though, when you were a baby I understand.

Speaker 2: 22:41

So, yeah, I understand, when I was born, um, he helped me. Um, yes, I think he, I think he was. I'd actually tell you, no, when he, I think he, I think he passed the same year I was born in 1972, so but he did help me. I was a baby, I was born, I was born, I was intrigued, I also. He's obviously a le as well, because I realized he's also born in August, so it's a small thing, but it was not that. I believe in that, but he was 10 days before me in terms of I think he's on the 5th of August, so I'm the 14th. So maybe there's a metaphorical passing of the torch in that.

Speaker 1: 23:20

Why not? Yeah, and so you did have a skin touching moment with this guy.

Speaker 2: 23:29

Yes.

Speaker 1: 23:30

And I'm curious if now, being totally you know, a full grown guy who he almost probably wouldn't recognize, what you would, um, what you would want to say to him not ask, but what you would actually want to say to him if you had the chance oh gosh, I think I would.

Speaker 2: 23:58

Who knows what uh would have happened with other choices. You know, if he'd stayed in America or whatever, come back here, I think I would say thank you, for I think you know, times are tough in Coventry. Coventry was pretty much obliterated in the Second World War. He lived through that, he had his family there and I'm guessing there must have been times when they thought it must be better to go back to Ireland, it must be better there.

Speaker 2: 24:33

He stayed here and, being a man of values, raised my father's, one of three, and my dad's a pretty incredible guy. So the values and the character he passed on to my father were inspiration to me in how my dad raised us as a family. We grew up in a very safe, loving home, um, and and I think that the, the, the, the, we we replicate what we see at times and sometimes we avoid what we say. I don't want to be that, but I know how to be that. I saw my father do that, so I saw how he was a father and a husband and so, um, you know, he provided for us spectacularly well, worked hard, took decisions and held the agony. He didn't pass on that and so I say thank you for that, thank you for that inspiration and the inspiration to be a better man and try and live up to what he achieved.

Speaker 1: 25:45

Thank you. Thank you for sharing that, Liam.

Speaker 2: 25:51

Well, yeah, I mean, I think it's hard to come up with something on a but not having met him, not having married him, but now just doing this and you start thinking about it, you feel like you do know something about it. It's given you a window into something about him which feels authentic and that opportunity so, yeah, gosh, the gratitude moment, that's what it is. Just to be able to say thank you, because, as we say, say we run so fast at times we don't stop and say, wow, yeah, we're in a good place in life. We've got lots of challenges, but with three boys left of it and in the trenches of of helping them, you know, work out who they are and they should, you know part of that and pop a couple and they should, you know part of that a couple of the jigsaw pieces falling into place, while they also, you know, as you were saying, have work to do to work out the imperfection and creating their own identity within the bigger story.

Speaker 1: 27:03

Yeah, I mean there's certainly a direct connection between those, your three boys and uh and their great-grandfather right, I mean, yeah, it's pretty like a live wire, but yeah, seemingly you know, um, uh, not there, but there well, but well, particularly because you know, I was never.

Speaker 2: 27:28

I was, wasn't a great student. Uh, I was particularly. I was never good at particularly math was not. Although I'm now in finance, it wasn't a strength of mine, whereas, um, I always remember, with one of my boys, that math teacher took me aside and said I I said, oh gosh, here's some bad news. What is it? I was ready for it. She said I just want to say your son did really well in the math test. And I said, oh good, that's great. No, he did really well in the math test. I said, oh, that's good. And she said he did really really well. And then she of English, and back in England, I was like oh right, and I walked away. I was almost. I almost felt like crying because I thought I know my, no teacher ever said that to my parents, and but it was. But again, it's nothing. Both my dad and my grandfather, you know, being in the industry, they don't want to be be, you know math was their language and so I may have skipped the generation, but the, the gene is there somewhere.

Speaker 1: 28:25

So, yeah, thank god well, brilliant liam it's been.

Speaker 2: 28:32

It's just been really nice talking to you thank you because I feel you know it's unlocked a few thoughts. You usually do this and yeah, but you have a vague idea of what it is because I didn't know him, who I think is having falling apart. I can still hear it um, the um. Yeah, no, I thank you for creating this space for me to have that conversation and and and connect with my grandfather. You know, um and think about, and some tangible ways in which I can tell that story to my kids so that they they, in time, have their own slots in the jigsaw which they can put into the pieces of their life.

Speaker 1: 29:22

Thank you so much for listening to this episode of who we Remember. You can see some great photos related to today's story, as well as find out more about our guests and their work. Just go to storykeepcom backslash podcast. Who we Remember is a production of StoryKeep. Storykeep works with exceptional individuals and families to document their life stories and histories through film. You can learn more about our services at storykeepcom. ¶¶ ¶¶ © transcript Emily Beynon.